Long and Short Combobot Alts Strategy

Trading Strategies / Bot Setups
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Before introducing the strategy let me give you my prerequisites which suit my opinions, risk and reward preferences

  • High frequency
  • ROI per day ideally should high 0.25%+. I prefer high ROI because trading in futures is risky and you want to gain reward equivalent to the risk
  • Makes $$$ every day by closing deals/grids
  • Made for Bybit as thats the only place i can trade futures where I live
  • Indicators/TA are useless. They work due to luck and can stop working anytime so I dont use them

Strategy:-
This is a long and short futures combo bot strategy for alts (not BTC ETH)
Unlike most strategies here where people use backtester I just use excel and good old maths largely to determine the risk and reward of strategy at every minigid/dca order level.
Also I dont feel combo bots can be properly back tested as movement patterns are lost in historical candles i.e you dont know if lows were made first or highs within a candle especially in volatility.
Hence I take the excel mathematical approach

Concept wise its simple.
Run combo bot on alt pairs with both long and short positions ASAP deal starts
Reasoning:
Crypto market is usually uni-directional or ranging for days/weeks/months before it changes direction.
Instead of making $$$ only when your strategy is in the market direction, this strategy is independant of direction.
When we have pump long positions close and shorts load up and viceversa.
When there is ranging like last few days the minigrids makes money

Base MiniGrid, Safety Minigrid, #of DCA Orders, Volume Scale and Step Scale
Long Combo bots dca orders cover 60% and short combo bots dca orders cover 150%
These numbers are not random as a long combo bot started at 100$ base order price has dca orders to 40$ i.e until last dca order -60%
Short deviation needs +150% for price to go from 40$ to 100$
So basically -60% and +150% are mirroring long and short deviations
TP 5% max used DCA

Combo bot settings
I use BO/SO 25/25$. Because i like to have 5 grid levels between each dca order.
then each min grid order size becomes 25/5 = 5$ as we have 5 grids
5$ is a gainium set min for order ( A major improvement suggestion about this at the end )
Volume Scale 1.05 as we can dca down a little bit. If you have more funds use higher Volume Scale. Risk and rewards increase with this.
I played around Minigrid levels and spacing so that we can get approx -60% and +150% coverage for long and short.
See excel pic to see how the math helps to determine these settings

image
image1799×579 104 KB

Link for long combo bot
https://app.gainium.io/combo/67093ca1e52c35f92de4d20e?a=424&aid=share-bot&share=fb00f11a-dd17-42b2-8cff-1c1a5af323f6

Link for short combo bot
https://app.gainium.io/combo/67093e5fe52c35f92de50f11?a=424&aid=share-bot&share=219d7f9e-2aa9-4dc5-8432-e5089166ff09

Capital and Risk:-
At the last dca order long and short bots need 1137$ funds per pair per position
But as a pair cant be pumping and dumping at same time we dont need to cover both positions on same pair. Another big advantage of long/short on same pair
I personally use cross 20x for all most my futures strategies. This way locked margin is low and free funds are high
But the uPnL column gives a good idea of the drawdown at every grid level.
Example with 371$ funds long combo can be run with manageable risk till last minigrid and 678$ for short combo bot .
To pick a mid point 500$ per pair is a good estimate

Ideally I would run this strategy for a lot of pairs.
That way if say one coin pumps like crazy or coin gets delisted the impact on the portfolio is minimized.

Liquidation Risks
Just like every futures strategy there are risks here too
If say one coin pumps like crazy or coin gets delisted we risk liquidation
If entire market has massive pump or dump we risk liquidation
Depending on your risk level determine if 500$ per pair is enough or more.

Suggestions to Gainium :-
I am not currently running this strategy mainly as 25$ base miningrid and dca order size is too much for me.
If i want to run 10 pairs i would need 5k

If the min order size can be made 1$ then i can run the same strategy with 1k with 10 pairs.

I am sharing this strategy with the hope that like 3commas,
I hope Gainium also allows small order sizes for Bybit as it allows for third party brokers. I have already made a feature request for the same.

However if you have a bigger budget you can try it out or can try with just a couple of alt pairs
Ideally >=10 pairs should be good.

Thanks for all the people who share their strategies and keep Gainium community active and helpful.

6 Likes
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Hey @Iamtheonewhoknocks thanks for share this! Looks very well fundamented. I think it’s needs a paper bot to see the pros and cons if you don’t use back test specially with a x20 leverage.
I really like see this kind of projects because beats all trends what coins can do and became classics

1 Like
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Higher leverage being risky is a misconception in dca bots
Say you have a 1k position and have 1k funds
In its simplest way
At 20x margin used is 50$ and free funds 950$
At 5x margin used is 200$ and free funds are 800$

The free funds can be used as margin for other positions or to cover drawdown of all positions

What matters is max position values and drawdown expectations at the covered range

More leverage is friend for dca

1 Like
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Thanks for sharing! Super interesting.

Regarding minimum position size $1, we cannot do that on the free plan but for paid users yes we can implement.

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Hey @Iamtheonewhoknocks, I really like the strategy, thanks for the good work! I understand your point about the backtester but Excel have also some limitations, here you can introduce the fees calculation for the uPNL but what you cannot introduce is the time where your order will be processed (I am not saying that you can do it on the backtester) but I think that some testing on paper can be very useful to test it in live and avoid this bias.

Also why do you say that you need 1137$ to open this bot? If you increase the leverage to x40 you need half less the amount :wink: will try it on paper.

Also why this bot is not for BTC and ETH? If the reason is grid separation, you could just lower them probably?

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Concept first, tests second. Congratulations. Thorough pen, paper and excel calculations can surely help to check the bot’s mechanics and to decide where orders are placed and what effect those will have. Backtest are great to validate those ideas with historical data.

2 Likes
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I’m sure you’re speaking from experience, so I find this interesting! But let me tell you that at the beginning of the year I tried copy trading on Binance with two traders who had very good results. Each of them used DCA with a leverage of 20 and cross margin, they used two bots, one for Long and one for Short, and dozens of coins… One was liquidated and the other closed the account before hitting bottom. They survived a month, they lost thousands using DCA+high leverage+lot of coins. This is not a story I experience this to know how they work. Risk is there…

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Hi! Could you share the spreadsheet with us? Those calculations for the DCA would be very useful :slight_smile:

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Understandable it would be for only paid members.

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BTC ETH have higher min order sizes so usually gets costly.
Settings need to be redone covering shallow deviations

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Well done mate very well documented :+1:
Glad to see that more and more people are sharing their strategies with the community.

Most of the principles applied to this perp strategy can also be applied on spot - if you look at the actual numbers and compare them you will see that the final outcome is almost the same — almost will all pros and cons.

Agree with you on the indicators and TA accuracy - recently found a way to use them only to trade the price movement either using percentages or time and it’s 100% flexible as you can use them to pester the price without leaving any movement :wink:.
Indicators are good for saving funds but also to make some extra profit if used correctly.

4 Likes
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the bot is no longer accessible

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Hi, can you make the bot settings available again.
Did you ran it on paper? how are the results? I’m currious to see how this is performing with high leverage (20x), my experience with high leverage are the same as @diegopiolo pointed out - I would love to use it to get faster profits but did not found a way how to make profit of it even If I set up a short an long version.

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20x leverage with a combo stop loss is dangerous. The combo needs to cancel all grid orders before closing the position. If there is volatility, this process can take 30 seconds or more, enough to liquidate the position before the bot issues the SL. I would recommend Combo on spot or less than 5x.

1 Like
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Its a futures strategy hence the short strategy
Recreated bots for you

long combo
https://app.gainium.io/combo/675a860555835fd5f12de059?a=424&aid=share-bot&share=9952f97a-f52a-4cd2-a0c0-dd4c62514fcb

short combo
https://app.gainium.io/combo/675a87bb55835fd5f12e40bd?a=424&aid=share-bot&share=453ea288-aa7c-473f-b93e-35dcd0d12a19

Addressing Ares point about high leverage being high risk,
This is a common mistake people who dont run futures make about it.
Its not an opinion its simple maths

Say you have a 1k position and have 1k capital
In its simplest way
At 20x leverage, margin used is 50$ (950$ borrowed from exchange) and free capital 950$
At 5x leverage, margin used is 200$ (800$ borrowed from exchange) and free capital 800$

The free capital is used as Margin for other positions or to cover drawdown of all positions
What matters is not 5x 20x or 100x but the max position values and drawdown expectations at the covered range
More leverage is friend for DCA.
Another great point i knew very late is funding fee for borrowing is charged by position value not leverage value
So someone with 1k position and 5x leverage pays same funding fee as me with 1k position and 20x leverage.

Anyways,
The risk occurs when people use high leverage and dont keep in mind the position size and drawdowns at bottom of the range.

Now coming to some drawbacks of combo bots.

  1. Say you are -40% or +100% from base order
    Even with the 5% TP i tested closing all orders on exchange is taking 10-30 secs
    During this time slippage has eaten int other gains.
    Sometimes more sometimes less.
  2. Combo bots keeps you in a deal for longer than dca bots. Meaning while dca bot closed deal on a sharp spike combo bot wont. Hence deals run longer and the coverage you need is more than usual DCA.

Hopefully that helps

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Yes, the risk doesn’t result from the leverage but from the missing margin. What counts is the effective leverage which can be even smaller than 1x.

1 Like